Film Junk Podcast Episode #376: The Amazing Spider-Man
0:00 – Intro
5:45 – Review: The Amazing Spider-Man
51:30 – Headlines: Spider-Man to Appear in The Avengers 2?, 4-D Theatres Coming to the U.S., Jack Reacher Trailer
1:08:30 – Other Stuff We Watched: Magnolia, To Live and Die in L.A., There Will Be Blood, Zodiac, Dirty Harry, Die Hard with a Vengeance, The Hurt Locker, Reign of Fire, Sunshine, The 39 Steps, Harold and Maude, Ted
1:45:40 – Junk Mail: Top 5 Movies from the Perspective of Sound, Celebrity Divorces, Rebuying Movies on Post-Converted 3D Blu-ray, Next Format After Blu-ray
2:17:55 – This Week on DVD and Blu-ray
2:19:55 – Outro
2:21:43 – Spoiler Discussion: The Amazing Spider-Man
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Comments (87)
Wow… judging by the split in ratings it looks like there will be some good conversation in this episode. downloading now!
Posted by Matt on July 9th, 2012Are you guys reviewing Margaret? Matt Gamble hates the film.
Posted by antho42 on July 9th, 2012That’ll do Frank. that’ll do.
Posted by Goon on July 9th, 2012Jay, are you serious? Peter Parker has a very contemporary fashion look. Tight jeans, low top, retro Nikes, retro, hipster glasses, retro camera, and those jackets he is wearing are all very popular modern fashion items. If anything, his fashion style might be cooler than the character the film is trying to project. Heck, his hairstyle is very similar to the Twilight bloke.
Perhaps, Jay, Canada, or to be more specific, St. Caterines, is “10 years behind” fashion.
Posted by antho42 on July 10th, 2012Unlike Peter Parker, Gwen Stacy look is out place. She looks likes she is from the 1960′s. She’s hot, so I am not complaining.
Posted by antho42 on July 10th, 2012If I think his style is 10 years BEHIND and you claim it’s current, then technically that would make “St. Caterines” 10 years AHEAD in fashion. DUM DUM.
Posted by Jay C. on July 10th, 2012In case you’re curious, here’s a link to Greg’s discussion about the Twinkie that got edited out
Posted by MovieViewerMan on July 10th, 2012http://youtu.be/V13CZnUCOaQ
Actually, I had dropped a spoiler in the review and then went on a rant about Twinkie and Hostess Cupcake ads in the back of comic books back in the 70′s. Super-heroes would do anything for Twinkies.
Great clip though…
Posted by Greg on July 10th, 2012Rocky premium next month!? Happy August to ME!
Posted by Falsk on July 10th, 2012Sean, you have redeemed yourself after Prometheus. Bravo.
Jay (love you, Jay!) did something that a lot of critics have done. He spent a lot of the review talking about how different this movie is than Sam Raimi’s – Peter’s personality, relationship with the female lead, addition of the parents, no job for Peter, etc., etc. And then he says at the end of the main review that this origin story is too similar to Raimi’s origin story.
Also, someone said that Peter doesn’t get shit on at school enough. Nobody remembers him getting beat up and stomped on by Flash in front of everybody in the school? Stacy has to save him – something she also does when she hits the Lizard in the school hallway when he is about to kill Spider-Man. (poetry, man, poetry – George Lucas style).
I think a lot of people are affected because this reboot is too soon – which is true. I think the people that liked it were able to put that aside, and judge the film more on it’s own, and appreciate the changes from the first one. The critics just think the changes were the wrong ones.
Honest difference of opinions.
Oh, and Frank, all of the Spidey strength gags happen in about 15 seconds, one right after the other. Ease up, homey.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 10th, 2012Sunshine is the best movie of 2007. Get on it Frank. Oh and what if the guy you lent it to has already used your barcode to get himself a free copy of Sunshine? score for him..
Posted by patrik on July 10th, 2012In Kick-Ass, the song (Adagio in D minor) is faster than in Sunshine. They also stole it for The Walking Dead I think, and probably plenty of other stuff as well. Great piece.
Posted by patrik on July 10th, 2012antho42: We have no plans to review Margaret at this time.
Posted by Sean on July 10th, 2012Re composers ‘borrowing’ music cues, this seems to happen a lot.
When Gladiator was nominated for oscars and they played a music track from it before the best score oscar they had some violinists play the track. It sounded like a track from Schindlers List. That had to be horribly embarrasing for Hans Zimmer.
I don’t know if it’s shameless plagiarism or composers having so much music in their memory they can’t separate previously heard tracks from their own ‘inspiration’.
It happens in writing too. Neil Jordan lifted the ‘when I was a child speech’ said by James Mason’s IRA man in Odd Man Out and gave it word for word to Stephen Rea’s IRA man in his oscar winning screenplay The Crying Game.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012if raimi’s organic webshooters made genetic sense, wouldn’t spiderman have to shoot webs from his ass???
Posted by my cat is a cylon on July 10th, 2012Gerry, I think you are confused…
This is the clip from the Oscars you are talking about, and what you’re saying makes no sense:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J98zkGcRS2Q&list=FLxDjRmmzy2cu0lpU6zp_E7g&index=10&feature=plpp_video
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Patrik, I LOVE Sunshine, but I would place it as 4th best of 2007, that was an incredible year for movies. 3rd would be There Will Be Blood and 2nd would be Zodiac. My #1 spot is the movie that I’m going to beg Frank to watch (and the others since the review was nearly five years ago) and that’s The Assassination of Jesse James by the Coward Robert Ford. I would love to hear what you guys think of this incredible movie now. It’s good timing becuase Andrew Dominick has a new movie coming out this fall, Killing Me Softly, and it’s my most anticipated movie of the year, ahead of The Master.
Also, I’m going to recommend a movie to Jay for the billionth time since he hasn’t said he’s watched it or responded to any messages, but you need to watch The King. http://www.imdb.com/title/tt0396688/ It’s a 2005 film directed by James Marsh (who I know you LOVE) starring Gael Garcia-Bernal, William Hurt, and Paul Dano. I’m not sure how you haven’t watched it yet since you love Marsh’s other movies, but this is definitely a buy. One of my all-time favorites.
Posted by bard on July 10th, 2012I think as Jay gets older himself (fastly approaching his 30s) he just gets more and more out of touch with what is actually hip… Him saying that these characters remind him of something from 10 years ago, reminds me of Reed Farrington saying he thought Hiphop was dying, or when people thought martial arts was history after Bruce Lee hit in the 70s, but alot of kids watched The Karate Kid…
It’s hard to keep up with 15-16year olds, it rarely comes off very good when adults try.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012@Henrik: Just because hip-hop has the word “hip” in it doesn’t make it hip. Any kid who watches a Bruce Lee movie can beat up any kid who watches The Karate Kid. The martial arts haven’t advanced since Bruce Lee died. Today’s kids are so stupid that the only language they’ve created is misspelled words. It rarely comes off very good when kids try to imitate Reed Farrington. (I disavow anything I’ve just written.)
Posted by Reed Farrington on July 10th, 2012Hey Reed, if you want to have a conversation, try and be more coherent in your writings.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Sorry to burst your bubble Henrik but The 2 violinists you mention first appeared at the 73rd Academy Awards in 2001, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J98zkGcRS2Q.
I can’t be arsed to dust off my Schindlers List CD but I’m pretty sure the Gladiator / Schindlers List track they play is Auschwitz.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012I’d put money on the fact that the violinists were picked to play at the 2001 oscars to show up Hans Zimmers plagiarism, intentional or otherwise.
The academy has a history of disapproving of plagiarism.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012Gladiator sounds nothing like Schindler’s List.
Posted by Kent on July 10th, 2012Gerry you’re linking to the same video I linked to… It’s obvious that the piece they play from Gladiator would have no place in Schindler’s List. The first piece they play is from The Patriot, which could sound like something from Schindler’s List, but that’s not too surprising, seing as its written by John Williams, and performed by Itzhak Perlman, the same two people who performed the Schindler’s List score. Perlman is one of the greatest violinists out there, and his style is very recognizable. I think you’re just confused man.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Check out the you tube link I posted and the track from Schindlers List.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012I did. But I think you never checked out the link I posted…
Anyway, I’ve spent 10 minutes listening to this now, which is probably more time than your argument deserves, and I still don’t hear any plagiarism. I agree that the music has a similar tone, but that’s hardly worth noting in the world of film music.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012The track they play from GLADIATOR (“Slaves to Rome”) sounds nothing like “Auschwitz-Birkenau”. I know they play something short right after that, but I honestly don’t remember it from GLADIATOR. Maybe it’s just there to bridge the gap between that and whatever the next nominee is?
Posted by Kent on July 10th, 2012The you tube clip of the violinists playing from gladiator is from 3mins 40 secs to 4.08.
I just listened to the Auschwitz Birkenau track from Schilndlers List on Spotify and I can hear a similarity.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012I think the point is that trained musicians can hear a similarity in the music even if a composer tries to hide it by using different instruments.
Posted by Gerry on July 10th, 2012Well, you are the one trying to make a point, so I would hope you could guess what it was…
If you’re saying we can’t hear it because we’re not trained musicians that’s fine, but you should probably take your points to trained musician message boards if you’re looking for discussion only they can participate in.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Oh, but – to not be such a dickhead – if what you’re saying is that the music is ‘similar’, I am inclined to agree. I just think that so much film music is ‘similar’ in this way that it’s not really worth noting, and definitely not deserving of being called plagiarism.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012@ Greg
Thanks Greg. I was going to ask what the Twinkie conversation was about but then I thought it would be fun to imagine that it was a lot like the scene in Ghostbusters. You’re right though, there were a lot of ads for Twinkies in comic books.
Posted by MovieViewerMan on July 10th, 2012“Nobody remembers him getting beat up and stomped on by Flash in front of everybody in the school?”
1) Someone else who looks dorkier than he is, is already getting humiliated much worse than Parker is ever humiliated in the film, so it makes his loserness seem lesser for it.
2) He stands up for the kid, which undoes a lot of loserness about the situation anyways. He goes down and he still refuses to take the picture. He goes in knowing he will get his ass kicked and takes it. That’s not getting shit on, that’s actively making a name for yourself, and it wins him the hottest girl in school immediately.
Try again.
Posted by Goon on July 10th, 2012Here’s that 4d Titanic you guys were mentioning
Posted by Zac on July 10th, 2012http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dJxj1mou03M
I have a friend who taught English in South Korea and went into a 4-D theatre in South Korea for How to Train Your Dragon. One of the best movie going experiences ever is what she tells me.
Also, MEXiCO??? Do you get free Lucha masks with those?
Posted by Steve Kasan on July 10th, 2012Wow goon you really hate this movie, huh? You can’t admit to it doing anything right.
A guy getting his ass kicked is a guy getting shit on, period. No matter what the circumstances, especially if he gets stomped in front of everybody. And he gets bullied in the hallway in another scene, when he’s hanging the picture of himself on the chess or debate or photography team.
So, just because his nerd-dom isn’t depicted exactly like Stan Lee did it in the 1960s or the way that Raimi did it in 2000, doesn’t mean he is cool. If it had been depicted the way you seem to want it, people would have complained even more about how similar it is to Raimi’s.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 10th, 2012“You can’t admit to it doing anything right.”
Spiderman saving the kid is good, some of the stuff towards the stuff is alright, the swinging is alright when its not looking too videogamey.
“A guy getting his ass kicked is a guy getting shit on, period.”
You’re wrong.
“it ain’t about how hard you hit; it’s about how hard you can get hit, and keep moving forward. . It’s How much you can take, and keep moving forward. That’s how winning is done. ” – Rocky Balboa
Taking a beating and keeping on is heroic, and he’s volunteering for a beating for this kid. And he’s rewarded for it with the hot chick.
Posted by Goon on July 10th, 2012“A guy getting his ass kicked is a guy getting shit on, period. No matter what the circumstances, especially if he gets stomped in front of everybody.”
So by that logic, would that make Flash in Raimi’s Spider-Man a loser who’s getting shit on? Getting beat up or turned down by a girl is not something that’s exclusive to losers.
Posted by Jay C. on July 10th, 2012I’ll tell you exactly how this is going to play out. In 2 or 3 years when the next spider-man comes out – and we haven’t recently seen Raimi’s spider-man (like last week!), and we have forgotten about the marketing, and the cut storylines and all that other nonsense – we are going to revisit this film on blu-ray.
And Frank and Jay and Goon (well, maybe not goon) and others are going to say: “You know what? It’s not a perfect movie but it is better than we gave it credit for. I mean, it’s a different spider-man than the comic book, but it works on its own merit. I’m going to up my rating a star or a half-star.”
just wait.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 10th, 2012Or it will be like the Incredible Hulk reboot which has its fans but nobody has any passion about.
This movie’s attention ends when Dark Knight Rises comes out, just like every other movie these days once the next one comes out. Done done on to the next one…
Posted by Goon on July 10th, 2012Flash did get shit on, and he was definitely a loser at that moment – everyone was laughing at him. But Flash is also not on the debate (photo? chess?) team. And he doesn’t have dead parents that left him with his aunt and uncle. And he doesn’t get bullied in the hallway for no reason.
Look guys, it’s not the exact same Peter Parker. After 50 years of the same guy, its okay for a little bit of variation to the story. Why would I want the exact same story?
Like I said on rowthree, if Goon beats me up today (at my age now), and I get super powers tonight, I’m beating Goon’s ass tomorrow. That doesn’t make me a dick or an asshole, it makes me human. Like Clark Kent in Superman II.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 10th, 2012Here’s another one for Jay’s music score rabbit hole; forgive me if it’s already been referenced. It’s TI’s “Whatever You Want” which I realize isn’t a score, but it’s the same chord progression. I’m sure its been used on some soundtrack anyway:
Posted by Brendan on July 10th, 2012http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2nuvrf3vZkA&feature=youtube_gdata_player
The Amazing Spider-Man has already made way more money than The Incredible Hulk. There’s no way this movie will have the same level as apathy as that flick.
I still think we’re kind of splitting hairs with the nerd stuff. It’s not like we’re introduced to Peter Parker and he’s the student council president and the captain of the football team. He’s still a nerd and an outcast, just not enough of one for you guys apparently.
Posted by Sean on July 10th, 2012Oops, meant to type “Whatever You LIKE” not WANT.
Posted by Brendan on July 10th, 2012Henrik, we missed you at Rowthree.
Posted by antho42 on July 10th, 2012Jay’s Dylan McKay analogy for Peter Parker is so spot on. Only difference is that I like Luke Perry – I definitely don’t like Andrew Garfield, who seems like the biggest tool ever.
Posted by Kasper on July 10th, 2012“It’s not like we’re introduced to Peter Parker and he’s the student council president and the captain of the football team.”
No, but by the end of the film he gets to be the new bully…. I am sure that in part two he will make a great president..
honesty Sean I just cannot understand why each time I have Indian food I get explosive diarrhea..
Posted by kyri on July 10th, 2012antho there is no need to miss me, I am always right here on filmjunk. Kinda stopped going to rowthree, since there isn’t much there I’m interested in… Can’t keep up with the shows, and a lot of the writers tend to push my buttons.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Speaking of Spider-Man and Hostess desserts, this may very well be the best name for a Spider-Man story ever…
http://tomheroes.com/Comic%20Ads/hostess%20ads/spiderman_spoils_snatch.htm
Posted by PlanBFromOuterSpace on July 10th, 2012The outro music for this episode is amazing.
Posted by Henrik on July 10th, 2012Just to clarify (not that I really should have to as I’d like to think this is assumed): This point about Peter Parker’s nerdom is simply one issue I had with the film and seems to have taken center stage due to a lack of any other worthwhile conversation due to apathy (on my part) towards the rest of the movie. If The Amazing Spider-Man was truly amazing, it would probably have been a nitpick in passing.
Posted by Jay C. on July 10th, 201250, hear hear! Sean really knows how to pick ‘em.
Posted by Kasper on July 10th, 2012#51 Can’t say I agree. It’s not really Peter Parker if the character is turned from somewhat nerdy to just some random tool who happens to like science. It may not be enough to ruin the movie, but even if the rest of it was great it would make for a shitty opening to the entire film and therefor taint the rest of the viewing somewhat, as it would sit in the back of your head and annoy you. For me anyway, of course.
Posted by Kasper on July 10th, 2012I am listening to the podcast now. There are arguments that the movie is brought down because it is not like the Raimi movies, and because it is like the Raimi movies. Which is it? The person of Peter Parker has been molded throughout the years by different writers and artists. This movie was another piece to that puzzle. I really enjoyed the movie. I enjoyed that it felt different than the Raimi movies.
Posted by Chris on July 10th, 2012Those John Murphy score samples we heard in the podcast were very reminiscent of Hans Zimmer’s Inception score. But they were not as much like that as they are to each other. WTF indeed.
Posted by Steve on July 10th, 2012“The Amazing Spider-Man has already made way more money than The Incredible Hulk. There’s no way this movie will have the same level as apathy as that flick.”
What does making more money have to do with whether or not people care about the movie? Look at the money the Grinch made in 2000, Shrek 2 a few years later, the Matrix Revolutions.. then look at totals for say, Children of Men and There Will Be Blood. Box office receipts don’t equal passion.
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012“There are arguments that the movie is brought down because it is not like the Raimi movies, and because it is like the Raimi movies. Which is it?”
The argument is that if you’re sitting through essentially the same story, it can be boring, and if the character is in your opinion, a lesser version of what you had before, it’s boring AND bad. If forced to choose, would you rather watch a boring familiar story with retread characters you at least like, feel real, and identify with – or… watch a boring familiar story with new versions of characters you now don’t like, don’t feel real, and don’t identify with?
This version could have skipped over the origin story like the Hulk movie did, but instead went back because it was going to do an “untold story” which it advertised and then later cut out of the film in order to save for sequels.
So in other words, this cash grab reboot bailed on it’s initial reason to exist so it can push back and tease the same reason to exist in, or across, sequels. An ‘untold story’ I don’t give a shit about. I’m not sure why anyone cares about the untold story with his parents. If someone wants to tell me why we should, go ahead?
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012Btw Jericho , Re: “it doesn’t make me a dick r an asshole, it makes me human”
As Frank would say… Please. It does make you a dick. You don’t need powers either. You can go to a gym or take karate and go back and kick ass. Doing so though, makes you an asshole. You’ve taken in new skills and you have the choice to be responsible or abuse them. Abuse is yes, human, but it also is an asshole thing to do. Its not mutually exclusive. If you can’t see that I guess this Parker is the hero you deserve. Go look up to this dick as your shining example.
You know, there’s a saying: “The best revenge is living well.” People who don’t listen to this saying are the people shooting up their schools, beating up the new boyfriends of their exes (or their exes themselves), and beating up people who gave them a hard time when they were lesser versions of themselves. Im not denying their humnity, but theyre still unlikeable dicks. Revenge is for weak dicks who can’t win any other way. If you gain superpowers you’ve already won.
Miyagi out.
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012Not to belabor the issue, but I had some of the same issues as Jay mentioned with Peter/Spider-Man. Although, I had issues with the Raimi movie’s changes, but it was far more in line with the original comic characterization than the new film. One thing that originally bugged me in the first film was Peter being in love with the girl next door, Mary Jane. That was a huge change from the comics. Aunt May was always trying to fix Peter up with her friend’s niece, who wasn’t shown in the comics until much later, and didn’t become his love interest until later still.
I mention this because it was a big change that was made from the character’s original development, but it worked for the movie. They basically fast forwarded the relationship in order to tell a more succinct story. The new film did some of that, but ultimately made changes that didn’t feel true to the original character’s motivations and development.
Posted by Brendan on July 11th, 2012Goon: Box office receipts mean that we will likely get a sequel, which means the character will get a chance to grow on people and thus become legitimized. Unlike the Incredible Hulk, which is essentially now forgotten because they recast the character and moved on as if it didn’t exist.
Posted by Sean on July 11th, 2012Haven’t seen Spider-man yet, but I love how Sean is sticking to his guns in the comments.
Posted by Zac on July 11th, 2012I’m with Sean on this one. Not only did I like it a lot, but after rewatching Raimi’s films (just the two, I couldn’t force myself to watch the piece of shit that is Spider-Man 3) I find them overrated.
Biggest advantage that this one has over Raimi’s is Peter-Gwen duo that is way more compelling than Peter-MJ. Where Jay sees universal and relatable Peter as portrayed by Tobey, I see broad and cartoony guy that looks like he’s from the 50s or something (now THAT makes him dated… not how someone dresses). And don’t even start me on MJ. She is nothing but a shallow, cheerleader type, wannabe actress that dates asshole with a cool car (Flash), asshole with a lot of money, who treats her badly (Harry) and All-American pretty boy astronaut (who’s probably rich as well). Am I the only one getting some serious gold diggin tendencies? And when she’s not annoying she’s useless screaming damsel in distress. The only reason I can think of why Peter would be into her is that she’s pretty and lives next door. But Gwen… she’s whole different story. She’s smart and into science, which makes her look for something else in a guy, which is why she finds Peter attractive. Them coming together makes so much more sense, because they actually feel like a real world couple. And when shit hits the fan she actually does something instead of just being kidnapped by the villain and screaming a lot.
And the whole undercutting ‘the promise’ moment. While I agree that it’s a little bit iffy, didn’t they do the exact same thing in Spider-Man 2, that you guys revere so much? I one scene MJ finds out that Peter is Spider-Man, and he tell her why they can’t be together… and five minutes later she leaves her own wedding and wants to be with Peter. And he says… sure? What? Why? What changed? WTF? How is that not undercutting the talk they just had?
Posted by cap on July 11th, 2012Goon,
So Chris Reeves Superman in Superman II is a dick and an asshole, so he can’t be looked up to.
Raimi’s spider-man is a dick and an asshole because he used his powers to beat up the wrestler (to get money for a car and impress a girl – not heroic), he beat up Flash Thompson, and didn’t stop the robber.
Oh, and by the way, Peter didn’t beat up Flash in this movie, he just teased him with a basketball and then dunked it. So you could make the case that this Peter is less of a dick than the original.
The only people this guy was a dick to was the criminals that he thought killed his uncle. In the original, the search for his uncle’s killer lasts 5 minutes. During that time, you would call him a dick for how he treated that guy, I guess. I mean, he was responsible for his death and didn’t try to save him. In this one, he’s searching longer for the guy (he never finds him) so his “asshole” phase lasts longer, but he doesn’t cause anybody to die. It’s called a character arc. After he becomes a hero on the bridge, he does no more “assholish” things.
So, no deaths and not beating up Flash = ashole and unworthy of being a hero.
A death, and beating up Flash in front of everybody = a great role model.
Makes perfect sense.
Hey, I get it – you hated the movie. Cool. Just ease up on the hyperbolic statements.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 11th, 2012#62
MJ chooses Peter in the end, so she ain’t a gold digger. Flash is the biggest faux pas but he’s a high school boyfriend (probably her first) with whom she dumps. Harry treats MJ poorly because of his father but she calls him out on it constantly—it is the crux of their relationship. If anything, judging MJ by the men she dates, the only consistency value judgements I can make about her personality is that she likes white American males who, all love her back. Thank god she’s a fictional character.
Which is more than I can say for Gwen Stacy who showers love for a guy who is wish-washy about whether he will continue seeing her. She is not a damsel in distress but by the end of the film she is letting Parker off the hook for being a liar, a guy who chooses intentionally to disrespect her father’s memory, and someone who did not comfort her in her hour of need but is now back for more. If I were to take that relationship seriously, there would have been consequences and Gwen would have dumped him immediately simply out of self-respect for herself… as MJ did to Parker throughout Spider-man 2. In the analogous scene, MJ chooses, unlike Gwen, to be with Peter in spite of his dual identity accepting the consequences of the relationship. If Maguire’s Parker had broken up her wedding Graduate-style then that would be a different story… afterwards he and Garfield could share pints at a bar over how they are both promise-breaking assholes.
Posted by alechs on July 11th, 2012Also… Garfield crying as he tells Gwen he can’t see her anymore and going back on his word is like Homer Simpson crying as he savours eating his pet lobster—can’t have your cake and eat it too.
Posted by alechs on July 11th, 2012“Box office receipts mean that we will likely get a sequel, which means the character will get a chance to grow on people and thus become legitimized.”
My issue was you seemed to indicate that more money = people care. But with sequels… Is anyone passionate about Underworld or Resident Evil? It has a chance, it doesn’t mean it will.
Jericho:
I forget when I saw Superman II last. But I don’t connect with Superman much, or most DC characters. They’re distant gods. I’ve always noted Superman was always a bigger dick than Clark Kent, in comparison. Overall though, like the first Spider-Man movie, there’s enough kindness and good deeds going around that he could have his dick moments, it’s about balance. Garfield’s Parker is definitely not balanced.
“Peter didn’t beat up Flash in this movie, he just teased him with a basketball and then dunked it. So you could make the case that this Peter is less of a dick than the original.”
No. Watch that scene again. It’s on youtube, go, and then come back. I’d do that but I’m already sneaking enough windows at work
– Back? Notice how Peter was just ducking punches the whole time, using the scene to discover his powers, giving Flash an out at all times? Notice how he just threw one punch which he didn’t even seem to enjoy, because the scene is all about discovery and not about petty revenge? Garfield’s Parker goes out of his way to humiliate Flash in front of everyone for a good while.
After he becomes a hero on the bridge, he does no more “assholish” things.
I keep bringing up the broken promise, and you keep ignoring it.
Also, everything alechs said.
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012alechs: your analysis makes me want to rewatch Spidey 3 soon, since everyone says MJ treats Peter Parker like an asshole. People were saying she was a bitch. Have you rewatched recently? Is MJ actually right to be pissed/did Peter have it coming?
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012For those who listened to our spoiler discussion about TAS, I just wanted to follow-up on that mysterious villain in the post-credit scene. The thing I was trying to remember was that apparently there were lightning flashes when the character appeared and disappeared. No clue if that is significant or not, but that’s where the “electricity” thing came from.
Posted by Sean on July 11th, 2012alechs: If you really think MJ is a better character than Gwen then we simply see things differently and I can’t do much about it. But I still don’t get why, at the end of Spider-Man 2, Tobey just decides it’s ok to date MJ. I never bought it, and, having just rewatched the movie, that scene and his decision still bug me. The danger is still there, isn’t it? All it takes is for her to be aware of that? That doesn’t seem consistent with the self-sacrifice thing that Tobey seems to be all about.
Posted by cap on July 11th, 2012Chain-reacting is the best way to watch movies, Frank!
I also agree regarding Magnolia. It’s a perfect imperfect film, and remains my favorite PTA movie. I only watched There Will Be Blood once, and I quite liked it, but I remember that what caught my attention was how stylistically dissimilar the two films were. While Boogie Nights, Magnolia, and to a lesser degree Punch-Drunk love (I haven’t seen Hard Eight) were characterized by fluid camera movements, frantic energy and a song-heavy soundtrack, TWBB took a huge departure and looks almost austere in comparison. I wonder if it bothered anyone else.
As for sound in films, I just wanna throw out there the first 12 minutes of Once Upon A Time In The West, which has one of the best uses of sound I have ever seen. It is also the longest opening-credits sequence in cinema history, I would think.
It’s always a great show when the main review is full of conflict.
Posted by Lior on July 11th, 2012Wow, some people take The Amazing Spiderman too seriously.
Posted by bard on July 11th, 2012Whether he didn’t want to or not, he punches him and knocks him 20 feet down the hallway. He could have kept on dodging. Garfield never touches flash.
And yeah, you’re right, Garfield’s not balanced. He just saves all of the people on the bridge, including the little kid, and saves all of NYC from being turned into lizards. Not to mention risking his life in the sewer looking for the Lizard and almost drowning. He’s a slacker.
And you can view the broken promise as a dick move, or you can view it as him being with the girl who truly loves and needs him and wants him back in her life. It’s open to interpretation – I can see what you’re saying, and you can see what I’m saying as well, whether you want to admit to it or not.
What’s worse, breaking a promise, or taking MJ back after you have just seen Doc Ock almost kill her?
But you know what, I’m crying uncle (ben). You hate the movie and almost everything about it. I’ve been there before and will probably be there again within the next few weeks.
Maybe in 2 years when you watch it again, you’ll like it.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 11th, 2012“Maybe in 2 years when you watch it again, you’ll like it.”
Maybe in 2 years… you won’t.
“He could have kept on dodging. Garfield never touches flash.”
Flash was gonna keep on swinging at him. It was self defense. 20 feet down the hallway is absolute moot when he doesn’t know that was going to happen.
“He just saves all of the people on the bridge, including the little kid, and saves all of NYC from being turned into lizards.”
You seem to have no sense that one can be a dick and still do this stuff. Michael Moore saved a person’s life once, but he can still be a huge douchebag.
“I can see what you’re saying, and you can see what I’m saying as well, whether you want to admit to it or not.”
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012We’re going to have to stop debating if you’re going to make up my mind for me.
This is what I would have done to flash – Menace 2 Society beatdown, baby!
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=snLPZWgXNf8
now that’s a real dick move, pahtner. That’s the spider-man I want for the next reboot in 5 years.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 11th, 2012In the meantime I guess you’ll have to live with a Peter Parker that acts more like Harry Osborn.
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012Goon: I only pay attention during the Travolta strutting, club scene, Franco’s “best of friends” line. That being said I think Raimi makes it very clear that Parker is totally clueless tool while MJ is trying to connect like a normal person.
cap: Don’t get me wrong, I really enjoy Emma Stone as Gwen Stacy way more than Kirsten Dunst as MJ… but I am also aware that Gwen is male adolescent wish fulfillment (she approaches him four times in the film, twice to ask him out and the other two where he rejects her). I also wanted to point out that MJ is not a gold digging slut. Those were my main points of contention.
Posted by alechs on July 11th, 2012and heroes can do dickish things – they don’t have to be perfect.
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 11th, 2012Yes. See previous comment about balance. Are we about done? We’re spinning our wheels. Say something ridiculous so I can be outraged over a movie I’m forgetting more and more by the hour.
Posted by Goon on July 11th, 2012Is Cunterage a real movie, or did someone make it up?
Posted by Steve on July 11th, 2012done
Posted by Jericho Slim on July 11th, 2012I actually saw the final scene.. After multiple hours of mambo jumbo melodrama about a suitcase ..an equation ..a decay algorithm and all this shit about his parents that went nowhere…. a stranger asks the Lizard “have you told him the truth about his parents?”
-”No I haven’t” and then lighting.. and CUT and Print.
The lighting was there not as a clue but more as a climactic device in an otherwise boring irrelevant anti-climactic scene.
It reminded me of “evil twin” revelation scenes
Posted by kyri on July 12th, 2012in 1980s soap operas..
I’m sure Cunterage is real. But I think I’d rather see Cuntrage.
Also real: Pee Wee’s Big XXX Adventure.
Posted by Goon on July 12th, 2012@Jay Cheel
Sunshine was 2007. Go back 5 years and listen to this.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oTr3SQtMoRE
Was the first thing that came to my mind when i heard the episode.
Posted by Markus Krenn on July 12th, 2012DIPSY-DOOOOOOOOO!!!!
I love it when Frank refers to things as a “dipsy doo”; he can (and does!) use it to describe anything, absolutely anything. There is no rhyme or reason to his usage nor to why I find it so hysterical, but when he unleashes one I go into senseless fits of laughter.
Posted by P. Traum on July 12th, 2012Amazed at the level of beatdown the movie gets on the show, then I look at the sky-high ratings by all but Goon! A 3.5/4 ? After the beatdown.
The top 10 of all time from filmjunkers had many comic book movies on it from what I recall.
At least you noticed all the flaws, cinefantastique’s podcast missed the ‘peter’s dad’ plot-hole.
Posted by Jay1 on July 12th, 2012Im with Sean, Thought it was good, 3.5/5 from me.
Posted by Spooksta on July 13th, 2012Lump in my throat in parts…im such a softy
I finally saw the movie last night and gotta say, count me out of the Andrew Garfield fan club. I’ve seen him in at least three movies now and there is something about his expressions and the way he talks that annoys the life out of me. The guy doesn’t play drastically different characters if you watch him on screen very closely between Never Let Me Go, The Social Network and now Spider-Man. In fact, there were times in this flick that I was reminded of Hayden Christensen in Episode 2 & 3. Not good.
I agree with Jay that leaving out “with great power comes great responsibility” is a mistake and the film is worse for it. I also agree it’s problematic that Peter is friends with Gwen Stacy, a hot girl in the school. So we’re supposed to believe Peter, who already stands up for the little guy and is good looking, also gets the hot girl but is actually an outcast? Not buying it.
This movie wasn’t terrible. It was just meh.
Posted by Bob on July 20th, 2012Leave a Reply