Open Forum Friday: How Did The Hangover Get an R Rating?
So now that a lot of people have had a chance to check out The Hangover over the past week or so, I wanted to bring up something that I’m surprised more people haven’t been talking about: its rating. The discussion will focus on something specific from the end of the film, so I suppose it could be considered a minor spoiler if you haven’t seen the movie yet. Go ahead and skip the next few sentences if you want to avoid knowing what happens during the end credits. Basically, there is a montage of various raunchy photographs shown depicting their wild night in Vegas, including one with Zach Galifianakis receiving oral sex from a middle-aged woman where his penis is fully visible. Granted, the penis itself was probably not real, but it was certainly shocking — and hilarious.
Now, this isn’t the first time we’ve seen full-frontal male nudity in a comedy… in fact, it’s become almost a requirement for R-rated comedies to show a little sausage as of late, but never in a sexual situation. I can’t help but wonder, how the heck did the MPAA let this one slide? Is it because the scene takes place during the end credits, and is only a split second flash of a still photograph? Or was there some sort of special concession made for Warner Brothers here? Keep in mind, this is the same studio that got away with a lot of violence and a PG-13 rating for The Dark Knight (Max Payne director John Moore had some unkind things to say about that a while back). Now I’m not saying I had a problem with the image in question, it’s just that once again the MPAA’s inconsistencies are shining through. Did you think the photograph was appropriate for an R-rated movie? Where should the line be drawn? What other movies have surprised you with the things they were able to get away with it? Give us your thoughts here on Open Forum Friday.
Update: I am realizing I might not have been clear enough. My main question is, how did the movie manage to get an R-rating as opposed to an NC-17… not an R-rating as opposed to PG-13.
Comments (93)
i was completely shocked that Superbad got through with the penis drawings.
i know they weren’t real, but they were detailed enough to be considered pretty vulgar.
i agree with you, it was funny that they included it, but i can’t believe that it only got R. Zach did use a prosthetic and he tried to get them to not include that in the movie at all, but still pretty controversial.
Posted by brad on June 12th, 2009Depending on how early the movie was screened for the MPAA, it’s possible that the ratings board did not screen the movie with the final credits/photo montage at the end. I know this happens all the time. On the one hand, it is unlikely that Warner Brothers would try to get one past the MPAA; on the other hand, Warner Brothers, in effect Time/Warner is a five hundred pound gorilla who could get away with such a stunt.
I think a more likely scenerio would be that the board saw the movie and the vote just happen to come down on the side of an R.
I was a bit shocked by it, but I don’t think it’s that big of a deal. Most people, Kirby Dick on down, complain that the MPAA lets all kinds of violence pass but is strict on nudity, most especially male nudity. I’m not a proponent of more cock in movies, but I don’t think a fairly tame photo of a dick in mouth in this day and age constitutes a huge red flag. It was appropriate for an R rated movie.
Given the way the system is set up, the MPAA is wildly inconsistent and will always be that way.
Posted by Phil G on June 12th, 2009There is a profound difference between a single still image and… well lots of still images strung together to cast the illusion of movement… You know what I mean.
I would imagine that the MPAA rules/regulations/whatever have specific language that makes the distinction.
I’m pretty conservative by nature, but this IS an “R” rated movie. We shouldn’t have to worry about children seeing it, unless their parents are f’d in the head… which I guess is a distinct possibility in this country today… but I digress – one silly photo should not be enough to make this NC-17 or whatever the next level is.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on June 12th, 2009i know for a fact that the penis shown is not real, it was a fake otherwise it would have had to been taken out or the movie would have got a NC-17 rating. I had a friend that worked on that movie and I was shocked to when i saw it that it got through. I text my friend when i left the theater and he told me straight up it was fake.
Posted by Chris on June 12th, 2009I think it shouldn’t have been in the movie at all. It is too much. If they’re beginning to let still images of that be allowed in movies, it’s only a matter of time before it’s shown for real. I often go to the rated R movies with my parents and I have been going with them since I was about 14. The Hangover is not a movie I’d ever see with my parents but it’s good to know these are the kind of things they consider “rated R” now and I’ll be needing to watch out for that when I do go.
As for parents, “f’d in the head” as said before, I feel its pertinent to mention there happened to be in right behind me when I saw the movie. A dad with a crying infant out till after 11 on a sunday night with 4 young 13-14 year olds, also out on a school night. These young children not only should not have been seeing that movie but they were also rudely speaking throughout the film. Specifically, telling “dumb b!tches” to turn around and whatnot. My point being, there are several parents who will unknowingly let their children see what occurred in the end credits. Had it been an NC-17 rating, that could have been prevented. Then again, we could always hope for responsible parents every once in a while…
Posted by Jeansar on June 12th, 2009NC-17 is the death of a movie for a number a reasons.
Roger Ebert has the idea to create a new label that is in between R and NC-17, an A rating.
Regardless, with all due respect, is seeing a dick on screen while sitting next to your parents really that big of a deal. I mean, seriously. Aren’t you all adults? As for the parents bringing their kids into the theater are concerned, that’s more of an issue for the theater owners, isn’t it? Take a cue from Jay, call them cocksuckers and be done with it. Seriously, it is retarded to bring young kids to THE HANGOVER, but should the rest of us be fucked because of the actions of the idiot adults?
By the way, the fact that it was too much was part of the point, part of what made it shocking, and part of waht made it hilarious.
Posted by Phil G on June 12th, 2009Jeansar,
That was sort of my point. You are always going to have parents that are “f’d in the head” and bring their children to innapropriate films because they are idiots. The rules are in place, if idiotic parents don’t want to abide by them, then that’s on them.
Sounds like those kids are already a lost cause… My only hope is that they don’t car jack me in a few years. Something tells me that daddy wasn’t a republican.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on June 12th, 2009@ I’m pretty conservative by nature, but this IS an “R” rated movie. We shouldn’t have to worry about children seeing it, unless their parents are f’d in the head
The concern is not “for the children”. The concern is that the MPAA, which is supposed to be an impartial parental guidline system, is rating the big six by different standards than the independent / foreign films.
Posted by Rusty James on June 12th, 2009@ Roger Ebert has the idea to create a new label that is in between R and NC-17, an A rating.
The problem with Ebert’s solution is that the NC-17 rating started out as exactly that same sort of compromise between R and X ratings.
Posted by Rusty James on June 12th, 2009The very idea of a rating beyond R is authoritarian. Why do we need a rating above adults only?
@ A dad with a crying infant out till after 11 on a sunday night with 4 young 13-14 year olds, also out on a school night.
Clearly the end is nigh. You’ll excuse me if I’m less than grateful to social conservatives who are tirelessly protecting us all.
Posted by Rusty James on June 12th, 2009I am in Australia and is rates MA15+ (Must be over 15 with a parent) and sadly the penis was blurred out. Let down!
Posted by Julie on June 13th, 2009Well, I have notice some minor things that could be the reason for a Rated “R” like when the guys go see Jade (Heather Graham), there is scene where she breastfed a baby & you can see a nipple just before that baby starts sucking on it, but that is fucking huge nipple that I saw, I was like “Whoa, that’s fucking huge. I want that.” Also there is scene where the guys heard a noise in the trunk & they open it up & Mr. Chow, who was naked, jumped out & beating the living shit of the guys. (You might say “Well, so what if he was naked? I have seen naked guys in PG-13 movies before.” I am just saying this because I thought it would be a reason for being R besides Heather’s fucking nipple.)
That is all I could think of, but I like I said they were minor little scenes that could brought up “R” besides the pics at the ending credits.
So yeah, The Hangover is Legendary & FTW!
Posted by Michael on June 13th, 2009Also I just realize that are a couple of minor scenes in the movie with some ass shots in there as well, but I don’t know if the ass shots, Heather Graham’s nipple, the naked dude that was trapped in the trunk of the car, or the pics at the end credits caused the rated R at all.
Posted by Michael on June 13th, 2009^^^^^Also probably the on screen blow job too.
Posted by Rusty James on June 13th, 2009The fact that it got by with just an R-rating is a fluke to the filmmakers themselves. Apparently there was a joke going around the WB lot that the MPAA left the screening before the credits rolled. It’s not any sort of special deal with the MPAA- just a bit of an anomaly that the filmmakers were sure as hell pleased with.
Posted by NYCFilmmaker on June 13th, 2009“i know for a fact that the penis shown is not real”
Oh, do you?
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on June 14th, 2009U guys are all stupid for having this conversation, did anyone think that the movie is rated R because of the excessive use of the word fuck and all the vulgar language. It is a perfect rating for a perfect movie
Posted by phil on June 20th, 2009Why is it ok to show female nudity and not to show male nudity? Movies get higher MPAA ratings when they show a split sec of a male penis, yet it’s not even phased when they show bare breasts. The movie should show more penis so it will appeal to the female crowd. I’m glad they included it, there should be longer scenes next time. It was funny as hell. Now if they could only get hot guys to get naked. Then we’d be set. Men get all offended because movies are just starting to include male frontal nudity in film. Yet us women have had to deal with the rdiuclous amounts of female nudity in every R film over the years. There needs to be equal rights in film. For every nude female shown, even if it’s one bare breast, there should be full frontal male nudity or NO NUDITY AT ALL FOR ONCE! It is time for EQUAL RIGHTS!
Posted by Laura on June 22nd, 2009Why all of a sudden that some male nudity is out that you decide enough is enough? No one complains when there are tits all over the place and practical frontal women nudes. You just are double standard.
Posted by Really on June 23rd, 2009I totally agree with the last two commenters. Female nudity has been shown in movies constantly since the 70s (not that I mind seeing it!) so I am angered and shocked to hear people (men I guess) actually acting shocked and appalled to see a little male nudity in addition.
Posted by Rebekah on June 25th, 2009But the nudity in this movie didn’t even phase me, honestly. I know it is a symptom of our culture’s fucked-up sexual hangups and priorities that nudity somehow ranks as an issue but all the other stuff (that’s a hell of a lot worse than a naked human being!) in this movie. Someone pointed out the copious amounts of swearing for one (again, not one that especially bothers me, but definitely worthy of an R rating), but hello, how about all the mentions of ecstasy, roofies, drunk driving, drinking until you pass out or lose your memory, lying to a partner about huge issues or trying to skip out on taking responsibility for ridiculous amounts of vandalism etc. There were much worse things for a kid to see in this movie than a fake penis. Hell, the racial and gender stereotyping were more offensive to me than that.
There is a definite double standard in films these days. Women being very illogical seem to think that showing breasts is equal to showing a penis. NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO it isn’t. Showing a penis is like showing a vagina and it is damn time to start showing some vaginas as often as they show the penis. It is time for nudity equality. Showing breasts is partial nudity not full nudity like males have been showing. I am sick and tired of this garbage of showing only the male frontally and not the female. females seem to only want equality when it benefits themselves. I have yet to see a female say that they should show a vagina every time they show a penis. These directors/writers/producers need to get their act together because I refuse to se this trash until there is true equality.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 25th, 2009I am sorry. Showing an erect penis 2 times in a woman’s mouth is horrendous. I am embarrassed that I took my wife, mother, and aunt to the movie. They were offended, and quite frankly, so was I. Actually, I think the movie would have been better off without the stills, and just ended with their faces, but be sure, I am very upset about this and will try to figure out how to file a formal complaint.
Posted by Michael on June 27th, 2009“I think the movie would have been better off without the stills, and just ended with their faces”
Oh you’re so wrong, that’d be such a sitcom copout, and the credits are maybe the funniest part of the movie.
You take your wife mother and aunt to R rated comedies, and have the nerve to complain after the fact? Caveat emptor, buddy.
Posted by Goon on June 27th, 2009“I am sick and tired of this garbage of showing only the male frontally and not the female.”
I’ve seen female full frontal in a lot of movies. The Cooler and Notorious Bettie Page immediately come to mind.
Posted by Goon on June 27th, 2009after a simple google search:
also Julianne Moore in Short Cuts, Diane Keaton in Somethings Gotta Give, Nicole Kidman in Billy Bathgate, Maria Bello again in History of Violence, Eva Green in the Dreamers, Maggie Gyllenhaal in Secretary. Of course Elizabeth Berkley in Showgirls
And of course countless other sort of to complete unknowns in countless movies.
Posted by Goon on June 27th, 2009“I am embarrassed that I took my wife, mother, and aunt to the movie.”
Loooooooooooooooooser.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on June 27th, 2009Goon- Compare the amount of male genitals in films to that of females and you will see the inequality. There has been and continues to be a double standard towards males when it comes to showing full frontal nudity. Take this piece of crap film for instance. Any male bachelor party would have most certainly had full feontal female nudity. However, they choose not to show any. They choose instead to show only male frontal udity. That is a double standard. There are also more examples of the same kind. The question becomes why ? Why are producers/ writers/directors so afraid of exposing the vagina as often as the penis ? It is long past the time for equality.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 28th, 2009“Compare the amount of male genitals in films to that of females and you will see the inequality.”
I simply disagree, and you’d have to provide me some mega list of major male actors showing their horn to prove to me otherwise. In addition, the ‘full frontal’ from Zach in this movie, as well as for example, Dirk Diggler, was a prosthetic. When I see any male full frontal its almost always done for comedic shock effect, because penises are funny, and well, unexpected – BECAUSE THEY DONT APPEAR AS OFTEN. The only time a female bush has been used in a similar fashion I’ve seen is in Life of Brian.
Posted by Goon on June 28th, 2009Goon- You are completely wrong. Look it up yourself. Use the internet and look up male frontal movie nudity and see the huge list. Then look up female frontal movie nudity and you will see a list that almost does not exisit. And it doesn’t matter whether it is for fun or not. If you are going to show genitals then do it equally not the double standard that is used today.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 28th, 2009dont just assert it, prove it. show me.
“look up female frontal movie nudity and you will see a list that almost does not exisit.”
http://www.cinemagora.co.uk/tag-1146-female-full-frontal-nudity.html
http://www.iheartchaos.com/content/weve-got-bush-top-10-female-full-frontal-nude-scenes-nsfw-i-heart-movies
Posted by Goon on June 28th, 2009You seem to have left off the male frontal nudity movie list. Why is that ???? Then you can see for yourself.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 29th, 2009BTW there are several films on that list that have never been mainstream films.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 29th, 2009“You seem to have left off the male frontal nudity movie list. Why is that ????”
Because you are the one making the assertion that there are more male nudity films than female ones, and have some onus to actually prove it. I don’t have to do your work for you. You either do some actual work and show me that there is a notable inequality or stop complaining.
And besides, you said such a female list pretty much doesn’t exist, and I showed you exactly otherwise. You also by the way, never ever said ‘mainstream films’, which means you are now guilty of a Moving the Goalposts Fallacy.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009Moving the Goalposts Fallacy.
How is any argument on any Internet movie website won without it?
Posted by Dave on June 29th, 2009First, I no longer do the work that others can’t sem to understand. It makes no difference. Once I do the work I will reasd the same comments I have seen too many times before. Well, they just started showing male frontal nudity, it is usually just done for comic relief, it is done for shock value, the guys nude are usually not good looking…….. It can go on from there. I said the I am sick of them showing male frontal nudity only. What is the excuse for this piece of crap movie ? There are guys on a bachelor party weekend and it would be realistic that they would see completely nude females. However, they are never shown. Instead, it is just male genitals. Why are you and others afraid of the vagina but have no problem with them displaying the penis ? Oh yes, I forgot… the illogical comparison that showing breasts are equal to showing the penis. Sorry, but that is just garbage. The bottom line is simple. If you show the penis then show the vagina. That is equality. Anything less than that continues the double standard against males.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 29th, 2009OK I can’t resist. Look under “Male frontal nudity movie list” search engine and then go to the link “Best Male Frontal Nudity Titles.” Now, like yours, there are those that are not mainstream films and it also includes some that are cable shows. The list contains 913 titles.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 29th, 2009I’m amazed this thread is still going
I mean wow man, you really either have a very strong aversion to cock, or some very strong need for shrub.
“the illogical comparison that showing breasts are equal to showing the penis.”
I’d love for you to show me someone making the assertion that that’s equal. I have never come across as such, other than you, so for now to me thats a strawman.
If you search on imdb under equal terms – “female-full-frontal-nudity” vs “male-full-frontal-nudity”, female wins.
http://us.imdb.de/keyword/female-full-frontal-nudity/
http://us.imdb.de/keyword/male-full-frontal-nudity/
There is absolutely no clear indication to me that there is a lopsided leaning of male to female nudity. You very explicitly stated “you will see a list that almost does not exist.” and I have without a doubt proven that is false. Maybe under different (but equal) search terms there is more male nudity, but that is besides the point. Fact is, there is no shortage of female full frontal nudity.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009if you make it just “male frontal nudity” vs. “female frontal nudity”, you get 916 male as you said…
http://us.imdb.de/keyword/male-frontal-nudity/
and 2019 for female.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009http://us.imdb.de/keyword/female-frontal-nudity/
I have other lists as well so this could continue to go on. The point is there has been mostly male frontal nudity within the last couple of years in American mainstream films.. That has become the double standard. If they are going to show the penis then they should also show the vagina. I notice you never addressed the question of why they were afraid to show the vagina in this crap film or why you seem to not even want to discuss the equality of showing both male and female full frontal nudity. And your earlier comment that penises don’t appear as oftten in movies is not accurate. And the fact that you you refuse to see the double standard tells me you have no interest in equality unless it benefits you. And that tells me you are nothing but a hypocrite. If the roles were reversed and they showed a still picture of a spread vagina instead of an erect penis in a woman’s mouth you would be irrate. If they showed a still picture of a vagina several times and then a slow motion run focused on the vagina as in “Observe and Report” I am sure you wouldn’t appreciate it. If they just showede a picture of a woman with her vagina exposed in the corner of the picture for no purpose, would you enjoy that as in “Walk Hard?” The example could go on. If they continued to show only full frontal female nudity and only men’s bare behinds and you continued to hear how that was equal, would you like that ? Funally, I noticed in one of your earlier posts you mentioned the exact things I said many females use as excuses that showing male genitals is just fine. Absolutely pathetic. Enough is enough.
Posted by Tim1974 on June 29th, 2009Watch porn if you want to see male/female nudity. Movies are good (I believe better) without nudity.
Posted by NC on June 29th, 2009“If they just showede a picture of a woman with her vagina exposed in the corner of the picture for no purpose, would you enjoy that as in “Walk Hard?””
Maybe, its all about context. I will say as a general rule I find penises funnier than vaginas, and that is partially because I know how uncomfortable that makes some people. it gives me a laugh on a different level I guess.
Maybe the debate can go on, but you’ve given me no evidence that things are the way you say they are, and that’s what I require.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009“the fact that you you refuse to see the double standard tells me you have no interest in equality”
And now you are dealing with ad hominem attacks. Once again, nudity is funny and/or sexy based entirely on context, and I don’t see the double standard when the balance in no way shape or form seems to be so out of whack as you claim.
As I said earlier, I can think of a time where female full frontal nudity was funny – Life of Brian. If there arent many other cases, that’s not my fault. The word ‘vagina’ is probably funnier than the vagina itself. Examples – when its used in the Big Lebowski so starkly by Maude, or the way Kenny Hotz will use it from time to time.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009One more thing and I’d say this has already gone on too long:
“a still picture of a spread vagina instead of an erect penis in a woman’s mouth you would be irrate.”
That wouldnt offend me if the people in the picture had the same facial expression of glee that Zach did in the Hangover. It’s not just the penis, it’s that there’s an old woman and he’s still so excited about it.
Posted by Goon on June 29th, 2009Here’s your list: Weeds, Lucky Louie, Oz, The Talented Mr. Ripley, Hostel 2, 28 Days Later, Saw 4, Shadowboxer, Tell Me You Love Me, The Crying Game, Brokeback Mountain, Forgetting Sarah Marshall, Big Love, Walk Hard: The Dewey Cox story, Sex and the City, Eastern Promises, The Hangover, Observe and Report, Bully, Alexander, Rome, Sideways, Bruno, Borat, Zach and Miri make a Porno, Wild Things and there are many others. This is just off the top of my head. You could also include the South Park movie and The Simpson’s movie. I might add that if that was Lisa’s vagina being exposed there would be outrage by every woman and woman’s groups everywhere. Also, pretending to jerk the baby off in The Hangover would also be seen as an outrage if they were pretending to finger a female baby. And now Bruno even gets a completely erect penis in it’s movie.
The fact is I continue to hear it’s about time we see penises in movies because they have shown breasts in movies forever. Well, for all you geniuses who compare a breast to a penis, you all need an anatomy lesson. They have never shown a graphic vagina shot. The cooler received a NC-17 at 1st because they showed Bella’s pubic hair so they had to remove most of it. Harold and Kumar had to place vagina wear on the girls or they were getting an NC-17. There has been a dramatic shift in showing male nudity and especially penises. The MPAA has a double standard by allowing penises, but not vagina’s. It’s not fair and it needs to change. Showing genitals is far more demeaning than showing a breast. I wouldn’t even want them to do that to women, so why do women and homosexuals want to demean men so much. Some people aren’t offended by it, but for some it creates low self-esteem and body image problems, especially when your body is constantly seen as a joke. You think this won’t have a negative impact on young boys. Other people like me just want to see a good movie without the uncomfortable nudity.
You people who think Americans are prudes and we should be more like Europeans are asses. What makes Europe our role model. You think parents there want their kid’s bombarded with sexual images all the time. Thank God for censorship because we would be in a pretty pathetic moral state if you people get what you wanted. We would just have pornography playing at mainstream movie theaters, but that’s what it’s coming to anyway. People with morals and decency need to be protected from you over liberal freaks, and believe me, I’m not a prude at all, but some common decency and standards is a good thing. You want to see penises, go watch porn.
Goon, I would like you to come up with a list that shows vagina’s in mainstream American movies recently. You won’t be able to come up with anything but bullshit! I watch a lot of movies and shows and it NEVER happens.
I would like to hear what woman’s groups would say if slang terms for a vagina was used throughout every movie and even on regular television the way it’s used for male genitalia. What they would say if vagina’s were exposed like the penis. What if male sports reporters were allowed in female locker rooms with naked female athletes, but not the other way around. What if men were giving custody of their children and most of the assets and monetary support in divorces. If most health care advertisements and research money was given to men’s needs. If women had to be the primary breadwinner and support men while they had the choice of staying at home or going to work, while taking away all of that hard earned money and assets she earned through divorce. My point is, women need to shut up because men have to face so many double standards and you don’t see an equivalent male group like the feminists complaining about all of it every day and lobbying for every advantage through laws with their big money by paying off politicians. So get over yourselfs and STFU for once!
Posted by Jason on July 1st, 2009Stop being a vagina Jason.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on July 1st, 2009Dude,
u forgot all the Ewan films like Trainspotting, Pillowbook, and Velvet Goldmine. And u forgot our sex toy parties, the way we act at strip clubs and our really raunchy bachelorrette parties that put mens lame ass parties to shame. We could wear shirts that say boys are dumb throw rocks at them. We could rag on men with no fear while its completely wrong for a man to criticize a woman. Look at how men are perceived on tv. The fact is, us women like to have the edge on men. We like to one up you and you are the fools that allow it to happen. It’s y were slowly taking over the world. We speak up and men don’t. We have taken over colleges. Female president will be next and then it’s really downhill for men. Guess youll just have to deal with it. Men are the new women. PUSSIES!!!! Ha Ha Ha!
Posted by Kelly on July 1st, 2009No wonder why men and women can’t get along! This is the mentality we have to deal with.
Posted by Jason on July 1st, 2009I will dominate you Kelly.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on July 1st, 2009Jason, you’re still a vagina.
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on July 1st, 2009I’m not going to argue with Jason and Kelly, and you know why?
First of all, I’ve already listed a ton of major recent movies (if Talented Mr. Ripley counts as recent so do all of mine) in my first posts.
Secondly, its the exact same person and the exact same IP. And considering how strange the argument on this page is, I would not be surprised it if it was also Tim just posting somewhere else hoping he could stack the deck by having another person coming to his aide and a fake woman ‘proving him right’
Even if I’m wrong about the latter half of that, Jason I will not waste my valuable time arguing with someone who is going to set up fake ‘battles of the sexes’ and then have the nerve to say “See? See what woman are saying?”
Posted by Goon on July 2nd, 2009I’m actually going to flat up accuse Jason Kelly and Tim as being the same person. The email you entered when you posted is the same as a person who has been posting anti-feminist rhetoric throughout the web writing almost the EXACT same posts as Tim. You also post as John J, sarah and Alex on this board, and then make up stupid excuses when you get caught:
http://www.selectsmart.com/DISCUSS/read.php?33,668810,page=1
You’ve also pretended to be multiple people on the RottenTomatoes board:
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/sex_and_the_city_the_movie/articles/1731279/its_not_a_fashion_romp_it_has_a_strong_emotional_texture_the_satc_women_are_still_making_bad_choices
Here’s a tip, “Alex”. if you’re going to pretend you’re a dozen people on the internet, register a couple more email addresses so you don’t get caught every time.
As for everything else, its clear now after all this and rereading your post as “kelly” that you have some very major issues you need to work out. I don’t appreciate spending all this time debating you honestly only for you to pull this move.
Posted by Goon on July 2nd, 2009The Men’s Rights Movement is the absolute worst. A repository of lost souls. This guy sounds like entitled male equivilent of Andrea Dworkin.
Goon, I don’t know why you would waste time arguing with someone who, right from the get go, was so clearly delusional.
And for those who are legitimately interested in seeing more vag at the theater I recommend the otherwise slow and boring Limits of Control.
Posted by Rusty James on July 2nd, 2009Damn. I thought I had a shot with Kelly…
Posted by Shut-Up Ed on July 2nd, 2009James, if you want to live in a world of movie inequality then that is your problem. Enjoy all the penises that they are showing. However, for those of us who also want to see an equal amount of vagina in mainstream movies we are making our voices heard. There will be no help from females who could care less about male exploitation in reference to frontal nudity. it is time to stop the double standard.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 3rd, 2009BTW Goon, you are completely wrong about yet another thing. I only write my own comments. AS I said there are more and more heterosexual males who have had enough of this double standard garbage and attitudes like yours. You are completely illogical and totally unaware of what is actually going on in the reality of male and female frontal nudity. If you don’t beleiv there is a double standard then answer this question: Why would there not be full female frontal nudity in bachelor party weekend ??? In the real world it would. However, they still chose to show only male frontal nudity.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 3rd, 2009Tim, I simply don’t believe you and don’t see any reason why I should.
I’ve responded to your grander claims and lists with my own using equal search terms. You have instead come back with me with insults and have acted as if the posts I made in rebuttal did not exist, and complaints about sexism against men in a movie directed, written, produced and starring men. There is thus, no good reason for me to continue discussion with you. If you wish to continue writing, go ahead, but they will go unread and you will get no response from me.
Posted by Goon on July 3rd, 2009Good. And just because men have written, directed, and produced films doesn’t mean there isn’t a double standard. For example, just look at the males who side with the feminist point of view. The same applies to the males who who put the films together. Yes, you certainly had lots of films, but then so did I and I could have had many more as well. However, let me limit the discussion to the last rtwo years and the amount of male genitals compared to female frontal nudity. And, let me discuss the way it is shown. Close ups, slow motion, shown almost the entire film as in “Watchmen.” And again the list goes on. You did not however, respond to the questioin I asked about the double standard in this film. That is the problem. You find excuses for ways to think that male exposure is just fine. ( Showing breast are equal to showing a penis, this film was made by men.) That is why there are so mnay problems between the sexes. If these films did show everything equally then there wouldn’t be any problems. But it has become very apparent that females and males, who won’t speak up for themselves, have absolutely no problem with the fact that males are being exploited. I can only imagine if the scenes were reserved females would be screaming bloody murder about discrimination. But since it is males it certainly seems your opinion and many others is who cares. As far as not believing me I don’t give a damn what you think. It has become obvious to me that you can’t recognize the facts in front of you. And as far as no longer responding…that is even better.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 3rd, 2009This dude’s the Paul Revere of on screen cock. Traveling throughout the internet, sounding the alarm.
Posted by Rusty James on July 3rd, 2009Crazy discussion. It is true the penis is much more out there for display than the vagina (I don’t include bush shots as vagina). But I suspect that the vagina will get its turn at some point. I also think sexual use of male and female genitals should be left to the NC-17 rating. I don’t know what is going on with the MPAA, but they have really taken a turn for the worst. I have no problem with them making adult movies, but it is nearly impossible to protect our children from R rated movies these days. Not so much the theaters, but cable has these movies non stop. While I can control what is seen at my house, I have little control at what my kids see at other peoples houses.
Posted by Mike on July 13th, 2009What is all this nonsense about “equality” with regard to male and female genitalia being shown on the screen. I’m fifty seven years old and have often wondered why it has always been acceptable to show naked women while the men’s private parts are covered up…This guy Tim is worrying that men are being exploited?…he really needs to get over himself…Women have been sexualized since the beginning of time and often held to the standards of perfectly airbrushed female bodies that are more like museum sculptures…..What’s next Tim..So you want “a little vagina??” in your R rated entertainment.. …How about you bend over and let someone take a picture of your butt cheeks…with a smile wide enough to look inside your butt hole? What is your problem?? Penis Envy perhaps?? Bring on those big bulging packages I say…It’s about time we women finally have the opportunity to watch idiots like you squirm in your theatre seats.
Posted by Siobahn on July 18th, 2009What’s up with the censorship Sean ? Twice I have posted and you have taken it off ?
Posted by Tim1974 on July 22nd, 2009Yes, you were not adding to the conversation, you were simply attacking someone.
Posted by Sean on July 22nd, 2009i’m all for ratings, but censorship in my opinion should be thrown out the window. South park says it best “either everything is ok to write about (show in this case) or nothing is. The rating of the movie tells you what you can expect to see in the movie. The penis was a shock value for a very very long laugh. If you didn’t want to see see something unexpected like that don’t go to the movie. you made the decision to go, then you blast the movie for what it puts in. take some responseability on your part and make wiser decisions in the movies you go see.
as far as parents go they need to take responseability for what movies THIER CHILDREN are going too. You ignore your children and let them do what they want and then they end up seeing something like that and you blame everyone else but yourself for lack of interest in what your children are doing. i call it the “blame canada syndrome” (people who have seen bigger longer and uncut know what i’m reffering too). And how did the kids get into the theater when they are supposed to ask for an ID to any movie over a PG-13 rating? So blame the parents and the theater on this one.
and if parents took thier kids to see it, obviously thier not very reponseable and could care less what thier kids see. This isn’t james and the giant peach people. It’s hangover, i mean what did you expect? take some god damn responseability for your actions and start taking interest to what your kids are taking in and what values they are getting.
I think parents have fallen to tv and the schools to teach thier kids about morals and values and when the kids come across something that doesn’t reflect the values they hold dear then they flip and blame the networks, and anyone else involved for the betrayel, isntead of standing up and saying “i was wrong for letting my children watch that” they say “thier wrong for putting it in”. But in my opinion, if you take or let your kids go to a movie like the hangover, morals isn’t really what you care about. Not saying it’s wrong to take a 14 year old to a rated R movie for bonding expierence. I’m just saying it’s wrong to take them then complain about subject material.
i want to blame the kids as well but i mean, who can blame them. this movie looked and was the funniest movie i have ever seen. the commercials looked hillarious. So it’s no surprise that teen-agers would want to see it. But i guess thats no reason to pass the blame on thier part.
Posted by rick on July 22nd, 2009I just don’t understand why we can have slasher movies cutting peoples heads off, dragging the body through the mud like it’s nothing and treat life with little or no respect, and show no remourse or sympathy for the victims. but when someone shows a fake penis during the credits of move everyone gets so pissed off.
Posted by rick on July 22nd, 2009So you are allowing Siobahn to attack me but not allowing me to respond. That is censorship.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 22nd, 2009Hello again Tim. I think the difference between you and Siobhan is that when I search your name on google, the only thing you do on every board is post the exact same thing, and then immediately forgo the conversation and instead attack people personally when they disagree. This thread was no different. You were even given another chance to keep talking with people, but you just returned to base level insults. If you end up getting deleted, I’d assume its not because of your opinion so much as because you have revealed yourself completely as a troll.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009thats a burn if i’ve ever heard one
Posted by rick on July 22nd, 2009Goon- Just so it is clear, I did not attack Siobhan, she attacked me. I was responding to that attack. As for my frustrations, I have heard how females have always wanted equality. However, now that it is males who are being exploited, those same females will not step forward and continue to express their concern for equality. Even now you will not step up and say that if Siobhan can attack me then I should be able to respond to her. Again, another example of a double standard. And I find it so interesting that you can just use the word ‘troll” to someone who is concerned about the injustice that I see taking place in the last two years towards males. However, calling me names will not censor my expressing my opinion about what is occuring. By the way, want to discuss the gratuitous, disgusting scenes of male genitals in ‘Bruno ?”
Posted by Tim1974 on July 22nd, 2009You are acting as if you are being singled out as some martyr of reverse sexism when all past evidence of what is allowed to be posted on this website shows otherwise.
I’ve already told you a while ago specifically why I no longer trust you and won’t discuss further. Having now read your last post to me, you said it was “good” and that it was “even better” that I would not keep discussing, so why would you invite me back now? You’ve said you don’t care what I think, so the answer is a flat no.
You admitted right then that you are only interested in posting your own opinion, and are happy without someone to rebut you. Because of this admission, the fact it was a repetitive post, because you are basically spamming threads all over the web – and ONLY on this issue – with the exact same posts, and because it was IN ADDITION full of insults (even if in response to others), Sean, in my opinion wisely, treated it as a troll post, and deleted it. You fit the definition of a troll very well to me.
I would not be surprised if he blocks your IP if you keep it up. It’s entirely up to him and his limits of annoyance. It’s annoying even explaining these obvious things to you, and probably just as annoying for others to read. If you wanted to prove you weren’t just a troll, for one thing you’d actually show an interest in any other topic on this or any other website.
But you won’t. Because you are a member of this group – http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Fight_the_MPAA/ – and make it clear within this group you only exist and post around the web to fight this one issue. And among your friends you labeled all those who disagree with you as feminists and/or gay/submissive males. It seems clear from this groups messages most of you have not even seen the films you are protesting. You have posted on this forum begging for help from your friends to help spam threads where you are in the minority opinion. So… how are you not a troll?
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009Goon, young as he might be, is what we call Old School Geek. His ability to ferret out information on the net is top notch. Tip of the hat to you, my Canadian comrade.
Posted by Dave on July 22nd, 2009Hey, it helps kill time waiting for Wipeout to come on.
bonus find – so Tim says he wants to talk about Bruno, but on this forum:
http://www.flickfilosopher.com/blog/2009/07/070809bruno_review.html
“I have absolutely no interest in seeing this film. I find absolutely nothing, even in the slightest, funny about Cohen. In addition, I have no interest in seeing a film that contuinues the double standard of showing gratuitous male genitals only”
It’s interesting Tim immediately wants to talk about the ‘disgusting’ use of genitals, even though he hasn’t seen Bruno to judge for himself if they were funny, or disgusting, or work in any other context. I guess just knowing they’re in the film itself makes them “disgusting”. I suppose if he did see Bruno he might have noticed that there actually is female genitalia in the movie at one point
What kind of people spam threads attacking movies they haven’t seen? Here’s a hint: Rhymes with “Bowls” and/or “Choirs”. And Tim’s not alone there – he got Noel from his threadspammer group to join him too.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009Goon- The fact that you even mention their is female frontal nudity is absurb. In comparison to the male genitals it doesn’t even count it is so brief. And I don’t need to see a film to know what is in it. I talk to people who have seen it and have read reviews that describe all in detail. Get real. And from what I read of your posts you have shown you have no interest in equality or what happens to males in any way. And it seems that you are showing your fear. Males are starting to voice their opinion about this nudity injustice and you try your best to put me down or anyone else who has the same opinion. Equality to you must be a scary thing Goon. Well, I will continue to make my point known until someday there will actually be equality nudity in American mainstream films. So I guess if you can call me a troll then I can call you a sexist.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 22nd, 2009Same old insults. Whatevs.
If you cared as much about Darfur as you do about cocks in movies you haven’t even seen there’d be a lot of happy brown unexploded people in the world. Anything else?
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009If you cared as much about injustice to males instead of doing everything to prevent the discussion of and showing of the vulva as often as the penis then you would start to become less of a sexist. And it would help you start to develop true equality and not the kind that you have shown now that you are interested in it only when it benefits you. And as far as “insults” go isn’t it interesting that you can say whatever you want and you think nothing of it at all but when I respond you call them “insults.” Another example of a double standard Goon ? Any questions ? And by the way when they stop the double standard of male exposure now then maybe I won’t need to go into forums and express the same idea over again. if you think it has become redundant then that is the point because what they are showing is redundant.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 22nd, 2009LOL
LOL
LOL
LOL
You are a riot, dude. I just love this lecture from the guy who labeled all who disagreed with him a feminist or gay. Rock on.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009Tim reminds me of Boogin’ Out from Do The Right Thing.
Posted by Henrik on July 22nd, 2009Hollywood is racist because I have seen more white penises than black penises in movies. Stand up for racial equality!
Hey Henrik, what’s up? Care to join me in my racial crusade for bigger, larger, blacker dong? If you say no, you’re a racist.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009You’re right, by gawd. P. T. Anderson should, nay, NEEDS to make another Boogie Nights so Don Cheadle can whip it out for all to see.
Posted by Dave on July 22nd, 2009Fight The MPAA: We are a grassroots group of males and females band together to demand that the female vulva is allowed to be exposed
Man, there’s a special interest group for everything these days. Tim you have a lame hobby.
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009Everyone knows the black porn star in the group would have the biggest wang, but the racist white media has to keep Don Cheadle and the black wang down.
I saw a shadow of Ewan McGregor’s cock flopping in Trainspotting. I’m just saying, if I don’t see Alfonso Ribiero’s cock in a movie soon, I must be right.
Provide me a list of movies where Carlton Banks from Fresh Prince of Bel Air is flopping around like the chocolate god he is, and then you’ll have a point. Until then, you are a racist, sir.
Bernie Mac is crying in heaven because the MPAA would not display his 15 inches of glory in “Mr. 3000″
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009@ Join with me in rejecting the movie industries vision for mainstream culture. Do
not buy any movie tickets, cancel your television subscription and tell them it
is because they do not show vulva. If there is no vulva in your entertainment
you do not want to see it.
it’s too bad your not looking for LOLva, cuz you’d found it.
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009“it’s too bad your not looking for LOLva, cuz you’d found it.”
That reminds me, the car industry is sexist because there is a car called “Volvo” that sounds like vulva. Until the Ford Pinus is allowed to roll onto streets everywhere, in equals runs of black, white and yellow paint jobs, there will never be equality.
(edit: Best thread ever)
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009Good news Tim1974! There are some upcoming releases that sound promising.
Lawrence of Labia
A Clitwork Orange
Dial M for Vagina
At last the revolution has begun!
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009also, Matrix: RevVULVAlutions
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009I’m looking forward to G.Spot Joe, There Will Be Menstrual Blood, The Nightmare Before Clitmas and Cuntbusters.
Hopefully it will balance out the sausage fest that was Free Willy. I haven’t seen it, but I read on the Internet that it was disgusting.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009^^^^ I knew there was a vagina joke in GI Joe! I sat at my keyboard agonizing over it!
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009I’ve heard great things about the upcoming No Cuntry for Old Men.
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009Me too. It’s going to be the best vag movie since Snatch.
Posted by Goon on July 22nd, 2009and I’m especially looking forward to The Color Purple 2: Inside A Black Woman’s Vagina.
Tim1974, I’m sure it’s gratifying to see your hard work pay off
Posted by Rusty James on July 22nd, 2009“Bernie Mac is crying in heaven because the MPAA would not display his 15 inches of glory in “Mr. 3000″
He was content with having the baseball bat be an adequate visual representation.
Posted by Dave on July 23rd, 2009The DaVinci Load should be gallons of fun especially since they replaced Tom Hanks with Adewale Akinnuoye-Agbaje. Fight the power!
Posted by Dave on July 23rd, 2009Saw this gem in a comment on You-Know-Who’s site:
“Besides, sensual nudity has little or no place in film anymore”
I agree! I demand to see nothing but street trash in burlap sacks in every film from here on out. The aesthetic beauty of sensuality is as worn out as a crack whore’s vag.
Put my cheerleaders in the baggiest pants as possible, please!
Posted by Dave on July 23rd, 2009If you choose not to allow my comment then I would suggest that you reevaluate comment #60 since I used that as a model to respond.
Posted by Tim1974 on July 25th, 2009